Online Appraisals?

[Kelly]

I would just like to know what some of the experts here feel about this link. Are they accurate? Is $19.95 a good rate for an appraisal?

http://www.collectingchannel.com/cMart/cesATEIndex.asp

Please note, I am not affiliated with this site, I came across it while looking thru an online auction site.....

[kristin]

I dont see how they could provide an accurate appraisal of a gem stone with out any physical tests, there are lots of simulant stones and synthetic stones that look exactly like the real thing with out physical examination that would significantly change the value of the piece of jewelry.

[Joselyn]

I have to agree with Kristin. The digital photo will NEVER be enough visual evaluation for any sort of real appraisal. On top of that, what credentials do these people have to evaluate Jewelry/gems? I only read the first page on the link, so there may be someone with real knowledge, but somehow I doubt that.

Joselyn

[Kelly]

What happens if the appraiser is way off in his or her appraisal? Are they held accountable?

[denverappraiser]

It really depends on what you want out of your appraisal.
In most cases, appraisal clients are interested in a professional opinion of the important value characteristics of their property and an estimation of how they could expect it to interact with a particular marketplace. They usually have a purpose in mind, like a desire to provide documentation for an insurance policy, a desire to divide an estate equitably, concerns about pricing and marketing items that they own and wish to sell, or a concern about whether they bought or are considering buying something that may have been misrepresented. These are very different questions.

Since they aren?t actually examining the property, they must base the entire description on your reporting. Here?s what they say about the accuracy of the description:

?The condition of the item being appraised is assumed to be as described by the client and from what is apparent from examination of the image(s) provided. Unless otherwise stated, the appraisal is based only on the readily apparent identity of the item appraised. No further guarantee of authenticity, genuineness, attribution or authorship is represented.?

Here is their description of the methodology used for valuation:

?In this appraisal, value has been established by the sales comparison approach. This method of valuation involves comparison of the property with similar items which have sold within the retail market that I considered most common for the subject property, and makes use of data obtained from examples of that market including sales at retail stores and live/online auctions, price guides, opinions of other experts, or other personal observations. Unless otherwise noted, markets explored appeared to be balanced and stable.?

There?s nothing especially wrong with this service but I think it's inappropriate to call it an appraisal. The biggest issue is that it probably is not answering what you want to know. They take a description and photo provided by the client, look it up in a price guide and produce a report about it. In the sample they also included some interesting tidbits about the manufacturer that many might find interesting. If this is what you want to know, $20 seems like a fairly reasonable price. I would not recommend making any buying or selling decisions based on this report nor would I suggest you base an insurance policy on it or use it for legal purpose like estate resolution or charitable contribution. I'm sure there are some purposes where it might be useful but I can't at the moment think of one.

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ISA NAJA
Independent Appraisals in Denver (http://www.gemlab.us)

[kristin]

I have never heard of their association before either: Association of Online Appraisers (AOA)
Sounds like an easy $20 to me...

[denverappraiser]

What happens if the appraiser is way off in his or her appraisal? Are they held accountable?

Kelly,

bupkis.

Their report says:
"The value conclusions expressed herein are based on the appraiser?s best judgment and opinion and are not a representation or warranty that the items will realize those values if offered for sale at auction or otherwise."


Pretty much every appraiser includes a statement to this effect (including me). We are not certifying the value of your property, we are offering our opinions. That's why it's important to get an opinion from someone who you think will give you an educated, unbiased and useful opinion. Eliminating one or more of those components will usually make the opinion less expensive but in most cases it's less valuable as well. Appraise the appraiser.

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ISA NAJA
Independent Appraisals in Denver (http://www.gemlab.us)

[Kelly]

It really depends on what you want out of your appraisal.
Since they aren?t actually examining the property, they must base the entire description on your reporting.


On eBay the jewelry items that come with papers seem to get the better money. In general I don't feel most people are educated enough to know WHICH paper work is legitimate. They see that it comes with a report and they are happy. However on the other hand it is better to come with SOME documentation than nothing.

[kristin]

On eBay the jewelry items that come with papers seem to get the better money. In general I don't feel most people are educated enough to know WHICH paper work is legitimate. They see that it comes with a report and they are happy. However on the other hand it is better to come with SOME documentation than nothing.


Actually, incorrect documentation is much worse than no documentation...

[denverappraiser]

As a buyer, I would not consider an opinion of value assigned by someone who has never examined the piece to be any more useful than the opinion of value as assigned by the seller without outside consultation, since that?s the primary source of information. In other words, it?s an advertisement written by the seller. If sellers need assistance in writing their advertising, they are welcome to seek it out but I consider it deceptive to describe this service as an appraisal because it leads the readers who don?t pick apart the fine print to all kinds of conclusions that may or may not be accurate.

I can only imagine that you?re correct in saying that buyers are inclined to pay more for ads that include this kind of thing but personally, I don?t think it adds much value. Inaccurate or misleading advertising will increase returns and refunds as well as increase the risk of negative feedback. Whether you wish to go this way will depend on your own style of selling and the nature of your own ebay business. This seems like a bad long term strategy for building a business that sells through ebay. As a short term plan that ends in ?? take the money and run.? it may be effective.

There are quite a few respected appraisers on their list of experts. I would love to hear from one of them about how these documents are useful and to whom.

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ISA NAJA
Independent Appraisals in Denver (http://www.gemlab.us)

[dbucfan]

I wouldnt advise using this service. sight unseen or picture appraising sounds like a gimmick...just my opinion.

[GGJoe]

I always try to take a "look" at a situation from a couple of different perspectives before I cast judgment. Many who've known me a long time can attest to the TRY in my claim :p because sometimes I can be a real bonehead.

Lets take a look at this same question as far as real estate appraising goes.
BTW it's a GREAT question!!!!

My city just got our new property tax appraisals "updated." They get updated every 4 years by the county appraisal ASSeser. We got our house independently appraised when we first purchased it. It just happened to be to the dollar, the same value as we paid for it. Of course, our realtor recommended the appraiser! :D

Late last year, a lender got it appraised for a mortgage. The property tax value of it was $50,000 less than what it appraised for independently. My wife was concerned but I reminded her tax appraisals are usually quite conservative. Welp. We got a mortgage on our house 5 months ago, and it once again had to be appraised. The guy walked through the house, measured the perimeter, took pictures, stuck his finger in his mouth and held it up in the air, knelt down and sniffed the yard, ect ect ect. The appraisal was again $60,000 higher than the property appraisal and I once again reminded my wife how tax assessment appraisals are conservative.

Well last week we received our "updated" tax assessment appraisal. They raised it almost $80,000 over the one 4 years ago, even higher than the lending appraisal. This assessor hadn't even driven by to look at our house. You see, they updated over 150,000 appraisals! It's a mess because many residents are crying and bitching (higher taxes). I talked to a real estate appraiser friend of mine (who incidentally just got a resume' from the current city asseser), and he said we can go dispute the "updated" tax appraisal with our 5 mo old appraisal, which was done independantly, and where the appraiser actually inspected our house and he said we've got a wonderful foot to stand on. I was going to get him to appraise our house so that I could use his but he said the Govn. doesn't accept an indie appraisal after their re-assessment because so many hire "a gun" to try to save taxes by lowballing.

My point is his point. He said a thorough appraisal, where the appraiser takes pictures, inspects, measures, investigates, researches, and applies similarities holds more weight than this yahoo who looked up numbers on a database and increased the values across the board.

Another friend of mine owns a street of houses. He's the type to buy a house, add on to it, improve it, and sell or rent it. He said on his street of houses, the new "assessed" appraisal shows the biggest house, and the most recently updated house, as the least expensive on the street because he's added an entire 2nd story and updated everything yet the tax appraisal is based on the old house.

This appraiser won't appraise a thing sight unseen. Even my best friend wanted me to update his appraisal for his wife's diamond ring, who was sold and appraised by someone else. He called me with all the info and asked if I'd type an appraisal reflecting a current date and value. It took time for me to explain to him I was actually taking care of him and being his friend by refraining, unless he sent me her ring.

GGJoe

[Wink]

My guess is the paper the appraisal is written on will be worth more than the appraisal, at the recyclers...

Wink ;)

[Diamonds]

Giving documentation of appraisal sight unseen isn't sound business practice. There are so many variables involved.

Instead of using this online service they may as well save time and money and use the instrument pictured below which is known worldwide for it's accuracy.......

[oldminer]

NAJA has taken the position that any member who offers an appraisal, sight unseen, via such an Internet service, will be tossed out of the Association. It is considered by NAJA an unethical practice. One might get a correct value using such a service, but how would you be certain? It is best to hire a real person to do the real job if it is an important matter. When you agree to accept a cheap job, you often get exactly what you have paid for, nothing or nothing much of value.

I just reviewed the listing of appraiser members and find no NAJA members listed. In fact, I don't think any real jewelry or diamond appraisers are listed at all. The ethical codes of practice within the jewelry appraisal world seem to be protecting the consumer better than they used to. :) :) :)

[JLPJ]

The ethical codes of practice within the jewelry appraisal world seem to be protecting the consumer better than they used to. :) :) :)

I'm not as upbeat. I've long held the belief that we are one of a very few industries that regulates itself by lawsuit--or the potential thereof.

[Diamonds]

I'm not as upbeat. I've long held the belief that we are one of a very few industries that regulates itself by lawsuit--or the potential thereof.

Actually many industries are floundering in the CYA model (cover your ass)
The medical field for instance. Call your doctor with a minor case of indigestion and it gets blown up into a full blown cardiac evaluation before you can blink an eye. Not that they are padding the bill, they are protecting themselves in case they overlook a minor detail which could result in a bad outcome.

I blame the lawyers......

[valsank]

It is an interesting concept, but I would be wary of the results.

[Jeff A.]

I regret to say this but many of the appraisals performed in 2005 are not much better than the ones performed in 1975. We have come a long way towards educating the appraiser but still have a long way to go. Our society licenses "manicurists and dog groomers" but not appraisers of jewelry. My biggest fear of licensing appraisers of jewelry would be the "grandfathering" clause that politicians are so fond of using. Then you're back to square one.

Jeff A.
www.metrojewelryappraisers.com

[Gregory Diamond]

We are thinking of introducing a service where you call us and hold your item up to the phone and we appraise it.

For Diamonds

VVS =$100
VS = $75
SI = $50


Ok, I'm joking :)


Greg

[denverappraiser]

I once had a client who bought some crystals that has been ?charged by the great pyramid? and was wondering if they got a good price. It?s tough to assign a value to this kind of feature so I rang up the dealer to ask them what they meant by this term. How does a crystal become ?charged? and what makes it different from one that has not been charged? After much wrangling and obfuscation it became clear that this means the same thing as ?shared a planet with the Great Pyramid?.